Sandra Miller of Runway, a technology innovation hub bringing together entrepreneurs, startups, VCs, mentors, Fortune 500 Corporations, and industry experts

Sandra Miller of Runway Innovation Hub - Podcast Transcript

Scott:	Hey, it’s Scott Orn at Kruze consulting and welcome to another episode of founders and friends. And before we start the podcast, let’s give a quick shout out to Rippling. Rippling is the new cool payroll tool that we see a lot of startups using. Rippling is great for your traditional HR and payroll. They integrate very nicely, but guess what? They did, another thing. They integrate into your IT infrastructure. They make it really easy for when you hire someone to spin up all the web services in their computer, which sounds like not a huge deal, but actually we did the study at Kruze. We spent $420 on average, just getting a new employee’s computer up and running and their web servers up and running. It’s actually a really big deal. It saves a lot of money and the dogs are in the Dogwood. We see a lot of startups coming in to Kruze now using Rippling. So, please check out Rippling, great service. We love it. I think we have a podcast of Parker Conrad. You can hear it from his own words, but we’re seeing them take market share. So, shout to Rippling. And now to another awesome podcast at Kruze Consulting Founders and Friends. Hey, it’s Scott Orn at Kruze Consulting and we have a really great podcast with Sandra Miller of Runway. And just want to give a little context. We record this on October 13th, it took us a little bit to get it edited and published, but I wanted to put that out there because the effects of COVID are still a little bit unknown, we are all dealing in the fall. So, I just want to add a little bit of context to the episode. Thank you, Sandra. You were a great guest and I hope everyone really enjoys this. Runaway’s a really great organization. Thanks.
**Singer:	(singing) It’s Kruze Consulting Founders and Friends with your host, Scotty Orn.
Scott:	Welcome to Founders and Friends podcast with Scott Orn at Kruze Consulting. And today my very special guest is Sandra Miller of Runway. Welcome, Sandra.
Sandra:	Hi, nice to be here with you, Scott.
Scott:	Great to have you. So, you do a ton of work with startups. I think one of our clients told me about you and I was checking out the website probably like six months ago and I thought, Runway is just so cool, and so I want to have you on the podcast. And maybe you could just start off by retracing your career a little bit and tell us how you found Runway.
Sandra:	Sure. So, I have a very securitas path in some ways that took me to ultimately getting to Runway, but the central theme for my career to date has been working with technology-based startups and, perhaps a bit uniquely I’ve done that from a variety of perspectives. So, I started doing that, working at the very early stage of innovation and invention at Stanford and I co-founded the Stanford Biodesign Program.
Scott:	Oh, I know that. I spoke there a couple of times when I was at Lighthouse back in the day. For those who don’t know, that’s a really prestigious and a really cool Program, I had no idea.
Sandra:	So, quickly the headline on Biodesign and the genesis for it was to teach a methodology around biomedical technology invention and innovation. And in medical devices, the majority of those technologies, the path that brings them forward is actually startups who then get acquired by the larger device manufacturer. So, building that and it’s now in well in its 20th year, and so there are Biodesign programs around the world that model themselves after Stanford Biodesign, and it’s been really cool to see the legacy of that continue to go forward and, most importantly, to see those inventions that folks at Biodesign develop ultimately impact patients, which is what it’s all about. So that was really cool, but it also played a really important role in my career because I really got solid grounding, starting with a blank sheet of paper methodology around innovation and invention. And I went to the Kaufmann Foundation and I had this incredible opportunity to design and run purposely experimental entrepreneurship programs. And so, I got to really dig into some interesting work around, how do you pick high potential Founders? And then of course, how do you develop them? And so, there are definitely some things that we learned from our experience there. And again, that was just really cool. So, I got to run programs for post-doctoral researchers who were commercializing their research from the university lab bench, people starting companies in the education technology space, all sorts of things.
Scott:	That’s amazing. I always think of the Kauffman Foundation because of all the work they do on Venture Capital and things like that. But really you are doing the real important stuff, which is the Founders and the people who are the ones who generate all the Venture Capital returns. So that’s great that you’re working there.
Sandra:	Well, it’s all important, right, because the entrepreneur [crosstalk].
Scott:	Yeah, you can’t do that without money.
Sandra:	And then I came back to Silicon Valley after Kaufman. I spent about half of my time in Kansas City where the Kaufmann Foundation is based. I came back here and started the Accelerator at Singularity University Ventures. And so, I grew that portfolio to over 35 companies that were located all around the world, some with us. But it was amazing because I was working with startups who were developing things ranging from synthetic biology to developing the first 3d printer in space, which was a really cool company called Maiden Space, developed the first zero gravity tolerant 3d printer, which was super cool.
Scott:	Wow. Singularity has a reputation… I’m forgetting gentleman’s name, but I met a guy who basically… Their fund just invests out of inter-companies coming out of Singularity. Is it fair to say it’s like the Moonshot organization, like it’s really good at producing super innovative companies, not like a new approach to doing SAS or something like that?
Sandra:	Yeah.
Scott:	It’s like, we’re going to the moon, or printers in space or things like that.
Sandra:	Yeah.
Scott:	Yeah. That’s super cool.
Sandra:	Yeah. So, working with Singularity, the focus is on applying what they call exponential technologies, which is the fancy way for saying, any technology that is rapidly accelerating. So that definition is always going to change, but applying exponential technologies to solving some of the world’s biggest problems. So, that sort of convergence is the focus there. And again, working with the best and brightest from all over the world, and I continue to have contact with some of those Founders and see how far they’ve come. And it’s really incredible. And then continuing this journey, I’ve been on the Angel side with a group that was called the Angels Forum, really one of the more professionally-run Angel groups in the Valley that has now transformed, as the founder of that group retired, Carol Stan. She handed the reins over to that. And so, what was the Angels Forum is now a really cool group called Mighty Capital. A terrific woman named SC Moati is really doing exciting things and shaping her own path with that group. And that’s a strong product-based marketing fit bias that they bring to it. So, I definitely have a shout out for Mighty Capital because I think they are doing some really great stuff.
Scott:	Actually, Jennifer Vancini was on my podcast probably nine months ago or so. And I actually didn’t know that was the same group. That’s really interesting because when she talked, she talked about how… I worked with one of our upcoming… She was on the board of… It’s all like product marketing focused investing, which is pretty interesting product management and product marketing, because they have this giant network of product managers who chime in or season [inaudible] special and source deals and things like that. I didn’t know that’s how Mighty does things.
Sandra:	Yeah. So, one of the things that’s interesting along this path is I geek out on startup ecosystems and accelerators and incubators, and I’d been studying them since 2009, when I was at the Kauffman Foundation. And I realized increasingly, particularly when I was at the Angels Forum and I was seeing all these B2B startups come in, and they were coming from the top accelerators, I was seeing that there was this big gap and that, hey, they made it into YC Techstars, what name it. But there was this big gap and the B2B startups were not… There were two things. They didn’t know the difference between an investor pitch and a corporate customer or partner pitch and those accelerators, the best in the class, were not really helping them prepare to engage with the other part of that B.
Scott:	Their future customers.
Sandra:	Yeah. And so, I was really fascinated by that. And so I ended up joining Accenture and their open innovation group at the time, which is now known as Accenture Ventures. And so, it was one of those things where you’re there at a time when they’re really refining their model, figuring that out. And I went there because I wanted to sit on the other side of the table. I wanted to understand that corporate mindset, because I’d never really been on that side before. And so, I did. In my work with Etcetera Open Innovation, I really got to dig into that. And just like working with investors and being on the investor side of the table, both of those experiences I think are just some of the things that really helped me to be an even more impactful and helpful advisor and mentor to startups. Because you can put on that investor hat, you can put on that corporate hat and help whatever startup that you’re working with, really help them understand that other perspective and aware they’re not yet connecting in terms of their messaging. And so those experiences again from a variety of perspectives really have helped to shape what I do now, and one of the reasons, when the Runway opportunity came along, I was just like, oh, my gosh, this is amazing. And this is almost the first time where I didn’t say, hey, I think I should come and work with you because I can help you do X, Y and Z. And so, I had this forehead smack because I realized when it’s thinking long, I’m like, why wasn’t I looking for something like this? Because it allows me to work with awesome startups every day and talk to corporates. And in their own way, they have just as many challenges, they struggle with even articulating the problem that they’re trying to solve. We’re able to articulate it, well, no, no, that’s actually not your problem, your problem might be over here. And so, I just love it because it brings all those things together.
Scott:	You have an incredible experience, like all those different stops because you’ve also been on the investing side and big picture, consulting side with Kaufman and then doing the Accenture style, so you know exactly what the corporates are actually looking for. It’s a really great combo. It’s actually really impressive. I love it.
Sandra:	Thank you.
Scott:	So, we were going to center our talk around, because I think both of us work with… We have 550+ companies and I think you have 300 or more or something like that. We see certain patterns with Founders. And so, we were going to talk about similar things, either helping to prepare founders or areas that they could use some extra help on to be successful.
Sandra:	Sure. So, let me comment on this in two ways. So, the first thing that I’ll speak to is, when working with early stage Founders, one of the things that I saw come up with Founders whether in a variety of programs, whether it was at Stanford or Kaufman or wherever, is sometimes you see entrepreneurs who you connect them to people who are experts in a particular area. Let’s say, it’s product design and you connect them to maybe two or three people that they need to get some advice on their prototype, let’s say, because their product needs some work. I’m not-
Scott:	I know you can’t see this, but the look on your face was hilarious when you said that. It was like you’ve had this talk 500 times or something like that.
Sandra:	Well…
Scott:	[inaudible] being like your financials needs now.
Sandra:	Exactly, exactly. And I’m not a product designer expert. And so, they’ll meet with a couple of those people and then I’ll check in with those people that I connected them to. How’d that go? Do you think they heard you? What should I know so that we can continue to make progress in this area? And then I’ll talk to that entrepreneur after those meetings and see where they are maybe three or four weeks later, and they’ve made no progress. And in fact, they’re telling you why those people who get paid and have a lot more experience than they do, actually are getting paid in that area. And so, they just ignored the advice. And I never take that personally and I say, listen, I don’t care if you don’t take what I say, no problem. But when you have the opportunity to meet with people, and you don’t have to agree with everything they say, but if you don’t take anything away from that, and if you’re just totally rejecting everything that they say, and you’re still in the same spot, you’ve made no progress, there’s something else going on. And when you peel away the layers, it’s a behavior. And it’s one of two primary behaviors that I see with founders and that behavior stems from fear. And so, they’re rejecting good advice. The other thing that is going on and it’s part of the rejecting good advice, but it also plays out in different ways, it is self-sabotaging behavior. And so, a lot of what’s behind that is fear. And you have to understand where the fear is coming from. Founders have it all out there. There’s so much that they’ve put at risk and often Founders are people who are hyper-competitive, who’ve been very successful, they’re very driven and they’re scared. Understandable.
Scott:	Yeah.
Sandra:	They’re doing these things and they just don’t have awareness a lot of the times. And at the end of the day, my job is to help them try to get to the breakthrough, right, because that’s what the point is.
Scott:	Yeah. And a bunch of things you said there are so powerful. The first thing I love is, you said there’s something else going on when you’ve identified the problem, instead of saying, hey, you’re scared, or you’ve got a lot of fear, or something like that. And it puts them on the defensive. You’re keeping things open by just saying, hey, there’s something else going on here. And there’s a pattern I’ve seen before and then trying to keep them open. Because they’re already closed if they’re not receiving that advice. So, I think that’s really, really smart. And you’re right about the fear. Vanessa is our Founder, but I still wake up in the middle of the night, all the time, with crazy fears or crazy irrational things that I can’t go back to sleep. And you do live with that all the time. And so, it’s totally normal. So, I think the other thing you’re doing is you’re giving them… You have so much experience, you’ve worked with so many companies, being able to say like, hey, it’s okay, I see this pattern all the time. Let’s get into it and figure out how we can keep you open and maybe open you up even more to some of this advice.
Sandra:	Yeah, and it really, Scott, comes from a place of deep respect because if you really look at it, a Founder is someone who goes forward with something when there is the least validation that there ever will be to build a business based on that. So, they’re the ones that had to have that belief when no one else did. So, what does that mean? And this word is very loosely used, but you have to be at times, particularly early on, a little bit crazy to be a Founder because you have to believe when there might not be other evidence and that belief has to carry you forward. Now, one of the things that I often say when I’m talking to entrepreneurs that’s built on our crazy word, is in some ways an entrepreneur has to be a little bit schizophrenic. And what I mean by that is you have to have that big vision, be carrying forward when things are going bad and yet you also have to be grounded. And that’s why when you read about, oh, so you’re thinking about starting a business, one of the things that people talk about a lot is, you can prepare, right. There are some things you can do before you just quit your day job and jump into that. There are some things you can do to prepare a little bit for that.
Scott:	It’s funny because I talked to a ton of people and some do prepare and some are very methodical about it and others just kind of go for it. And I’m not even sure, like I’ve never done the study or done the math on what works better. I think the preparing can be a lot less stressful, but then you also find another form of self-sabotage, which is kind of iterating, but not actually [crosstalk]
Sandra:	Yeah, because at some time you just have to jump the heck in. You have to go all in. The thing is, this is very personal. It’s going to be different for every person. I feel I learned from every single entrepreneur that I get to talk to. I get just as much out of that discussion as hopefully I’m helping them with.
Scott:	Yeah, totally. That’s why you do it. I’m the same way. That’s what makes my job so rewarding. It’s not about financial stuff, it’s about feeling you’re helping people gain that validation.
Sandra:	Right. You have these conversations with people when they’re at that decision point and they will talk you through. I know this doesn’t make logical sense, but I have to do it now. And the thing is, in some ways, that’s what you want to hear. If they have such a passion that it is really keeping them from doing other things, then they probably should do it.
Scott:	Hey, it’s Scott Orn at Kruze Consulting. And before we get back to the podcast, quick shout out to ChartHop. ChartHopv is one of my favorite new SAS tools on the market. And basically, what ChartHop does is it puts your org chart in the cloud. And I always like to say like, it brings transparency to your organization. And so, everyone in your organization can see who they report to. They can see the full [inaudible 00:00:21:38] of the company and how their group relates to other groups. It also has a lot of information on individuals in the company. And so you can click on the ChartHop profile and just get where people live, their experience, Slack handles all this kind of stuff. And it’s just a really great tool. The other thing is ChartHop has started doing some cool stuff around compensation and budgeting planning. And so, you can actually start seeing what the cost structure of the company looks like during certain kind of scenarios. So, I’m loving ChartHop, check it out, chartHop.com. We use it at Kruze, really like it, and I can’t recommend it enough. All right. Back to the podcast. And being able to articulate that though, is helpful, particularly to you as a mentor or me as a mentor, is really helpful because then you know they’re not, not doing something for some reason that you don’t know, or it opens them up and you can understand where they’re going. And then that way, the next time something comes up where, in your example, they’re meeting with a fortune 500 company or just a business customer, they get practice and articulating why they’re not going to take that advice or why that advice. And it keeps all their advisors close and emotionally invested in them too.
Sandra:	Yeah. Absolutely.
Scott:	That’s really cool. What are some of the analysis paralysis? They are not listening to advice, those are like the opposite ends of things, because you see some people, and I’ve been one of these people, I’ve started things that didn’t work and I’ve been the analysis paralysis person too. One of the reasons Kruze is successful is because Vanessa, our Founder is just like… She will just go. She just knows you like we’ll make things happen. What are some of the other archetypes you’ve seen or common mistakes you’ve seen?
Sandra:	I think one of the most common ones is around fundraising and really fundraising is almost constant. And so, you see particularly a lot of technical Founders just… They hate it so much, which I understand, but they really wait too long and they don’t understand how long it takes sometimes to raise the funding. On that same vein, I think the other thing that I see early Founder CEOs struggle with is the fundraising process and managing it as a process because it really lays an important foundation for your company going forward. And actually, how you manage that fundraising process and the communications around it can set a strong foundation for you to continue to build your company. And I call it building an engine for fundraising because even early on, you will inevitably have people who are your advisors, whether that’s formal or not, and Seed investors. And, what I see is a lot of CEOs just think that they are the only ones, that they need to do all of it. And so, I think this is the importance of having a board, even if it’s not a formal board, but it’s critical because a board and board meetings put together some infrastructure for you. And with fundraising, that infrastructure is critical because you want to build accountability. So, if you don’t like formality, think about it as the fundraising committee, so you are creating the deal room where all the information about all the latest presentation materials, the one pager, everything that you need… So that those people around the table for this company who are incentivized for the success of this company, they’re flexing their networks on behalf of the company. They’re making introductions. If they believe in the company they can maybe find other people who might be interested to come in and don’t have that accountability of, okay, this is who I’ve spoken to in the last two weeks, this is the outcome, this is why they said no. And they’re often not going to say no, they’re going to say, talk to us when you have X, you know, whatever. But you track that. And that’s more important to have when guess what, when you get your first term sheet and somebody is considering diligence, who are they going to pick up the phone and call? They’re going to want to talk to somebody who’s observed [crosstalk 00:26:32].
Scott:	Totally, totally.
Sandra:	… Through that process. And so, if you’re managing that process well, goodness, you’re going to have a great story to tell, one more diligence call, because I’ve been on those diligence calls and you want to be able to tell, well, here… And because the investor’s looking for, what’s that Founder’s ability to execute? Give me evidence, give me example.
Scott:	Totally. A pattern, right? I always say, even before you’re getting the fundraising, I call it professionalizing your company, and it’s one of the things that Venture Capital or even Angel Investors and the Seed Fund and Pre-seed Funds really do well, which is they exert a little bit of pressure on you to professionalize. It’s like taking your vitamins, you don’t always want to do it. But like even just the monthly email updates early in the month and having all the metrics and having the commentary, and I recorded a video on this recently, I’m just like, what should be in that, that builds so much confidence. And it’s also like, you’re building your muscles, you’re building your repetitions and I’m a habits person. So that habit of doing that every month really helps you, and the cool thing is you’ve been forced to work out your metrics and all the commentary and all that stuff way before you’re ever fundraising again. And so like, I think you’re saying this too, sometimes I’ll see companies that’s like, okay, it’s time to raise money. And then they have to figure out what they’re going to be benchmarked on and what they’re going to be evaluated on. If you’d done this stuff nine months ago, it’s just part of the operations of the company. And so, I think what you’re saying is really, really good advice because it does empower the other investors to make those intros and put their credibility on. Everyone has their spending credibility when they’re making those intros and they will only want to do it if it’s going to be a good return on that credibility.
Sandra:	Yeah.
Scott:	Your advice is phenomenal.
Sandra:	Yeah. I think the other reason for having tight communications around that is because fundraising is a very… You learn so much and you iterate from every discussion that you have with investors. And so, I love that you mentioned the newsletter because with some of the companies that I’m an advisor to, that has been one of my recommendations earlier on, and it’s interesting to see now, years down the road, how that newsletter has evolved and the role that it plays. But that is great advice because if you’re not yet sending a monthly update to the group of people, whether they have equity in your company yet or not, so the group of people that are supporting you, you got to give them information. It doesn’t need to be a Bible. It doesn’t need to be super long, but they need to have the information so they know when you need help-
Scott:	Yeah. Totally, and-
Sandra:	… And how they can help you.
Scott:	… The companies that go silent are the ones that almost always are not doing well. And investors know that. Like if you’re an investor you’ve invested in 50 companies, not three, you know the patterns. The other thing I’d say is that newsletter, or just these communications you’re talking about with your board and the board meeting infrastructure and all this stuff, it helps you establish, I’ll just say, it’s called True North. And so, you go through fundraising and you’re right, you get a ton of information, but some of those meetings are like wacky or the person doesn’t understand what you’re doing or whatever. And so, you have your True North already established, and you know if that person just doesn’t understand is giving you bad advice. It brings it full circle back to what you were talking about at the beginning like, it’s frustrating when people don’t take good advice. But when you’ve established True North, you know what is good advice and what isn’t. Everyone around you understands, like why the feedback from that one investor was not accurate or was not good, or he just maybe had a bad day that day or whatever it is. I love it when you’re talking about, all this prep work just really pays off. It pays off in a bigger valuation, it pays off in more money, it pays off in ease and speed. And that’s something… Getting it done quickly, helps you get back to work faster. It’s just really, really powerful.
Sandra:	Yeah. And I think that True North concept really resonates because guess what else it does, is that by having that as the central focus that keeps everyone, including our board, on point. That’s where it’s like, okay, what’s the most important thing? The most important thing is True North and where this company is going and why this company exists and where we’re all going. Because guess what, we all know that bad things and setbacks are inevitable. And so, you’re able to manage that in a context relative to making progress on [inaudible]
Scott:	Yeah, you’re so right. Well, I can talk to you all day. I have to be respectful of your calendar, but maybe you could tell everyone how to find you and how to find Runway. And I can’t endorse you enough. And just even in this conversation, you and I are totally on the same wavelength. It’s a pleasure to talk to you.
Sandra:	Likewise. Well, let me just mention a few things about Runway. So Runway Innovation Hub was founded in 2013. So, we’ve been around for a while and we’re located in the Twitter building in San Francisco. And our raison d’etre is, we are a San Francisco based Hub that provides workspace, corporate innovation and events services now online, to a truly global community of tech startups, and enterprises. One of the important things to understand about Runway relative to a lot of other players in the space is, we’re very much not on the co-working side. We’re not in the button seats model. We’re really focused on a curated community of tech startups, and then people who want to engage with tech startups. That’s what our focus is on the co-working side. The other half of our business is a corporate innovation consulting group. And so, we have major global 2000 corporate clients, and we engage with them in more of a boutique bespoke approach because every company that you meet with, they’re at different stages in their innovation maturity, they have very different innovation challenges. Sometimes they’re more internally focused. Sometimes they’re trying to figure out how to engage with startups, how to curate their own ecosystem. That’s something that we help them with. I think a couple other things to highlight right now about Runway just in the interest of time is, one thing that we’ve done because of COVID and because we have this global community is, we have launched an all-inclusive virtual office. We think about it. Originally, our profile of who we had in mind for that is that entrepreneur who has that business, maybe outside the US, and they’re ready to bring it to Silicon Valley, San Francisco, and they’re ready to scale. And they’re looking for a base as they start, what can be anywhere from like a six to two years’ journey, as they test the market and start to make progress. They probably are starting with a Biz Dev consultant here on the ground. Well, so that’s changed a bit. And so we’re getting folks who fit that profile, but we also are having folks join who are in an apartment in San Francisco and it’s [inaudible].
Scott:	Just needs some company.
Sandra:	Yeah. And it’s 650 square feet, and they’re like going nuts and they’re not ready to make more of a commitment. This is just their first… They just want to know that they have a place to go and a community to engage with as they start to leave the apartment. And we have done a lot in our space to be COVID safe. We’ve a whole bunch of furniture and we have this rigorous cleaning regimen. And so, you have plenty of space where you’re not going to be around anybody else. You can feel very safe. Your desk will be wiped down probably at least once while you’re even there.
Scott:	Oh, nice.
Sandra:	It’s pretty. Yeah. And we are very careful about how many people we let in on any given day, all of that, it’s really carefully monitored. And so that is on the co-working side, something that is of interest to people. On the corporate innovation side, one of the things that we’re doing is we have a different approach. We’ve evolved the model for what was the typical custom corporate accelerator program. And we’ve integrated that, curating an ecosystem around that. And so, we have one now happening in the living city space, and we have a partner with that and we expect to be launching a call for applications. First of those, that happens to be around themes like health and wellness education, which can be anything from pre-K to lifelong learning, and also property tech and construction tech.
Scott:	Nice, nice.
Sandra:	So, that innovation hub model, I think has a lot of goodness for corporates. It’s a much more realistic, I think in terms of what’s going on and thinking about being at that cutting edge and then having an ecosystem of players that are synergistic with that, people that might be partners with that corporate startups, they might want to have pilot studies with, maybe even invest and acquire what have you. And so that’s something that we’re really excited and this innovation hub model, we think, can be applied in other verticals as well. And so, this is the first one that we’re kicking off with.
Scott:	Wow. I love it. You’ve got so much great stuff going, and I love how your focus is bringing both helping the Founders and coaching them, but also bringing the corporates who are just as important part of the equation, without their business, without their support, without their funding, none of this happens. So, it’s a really great role you play in the ecosystem and thank you for doing that.
Sandra:	Well, thank you. Yeah, really fun.
Scott:	So, if anyone wants to check out runwayrunaway. [inaudible]
Sandra:	[inaudible]that is.
Scott:	And check out Sandra. And thank you, Sandra, I really appreciate your time. And you’re amazing. Thank you.
Sandra:	Thank you, Scott. Pleasure to be with you all today.
Singer:	(singing) It’s Kruze Consulting Founders and Friends with your host, Scotty Orn.

Sandra Miller of Runway, a technology innovation hub bringing together entrepreneurs, startups, VCs, mentors, Fortune 500 Corporations, and industry experts

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